It's being speculated elsewhere that Keane's sacking has David Nucifora's fingerprints all over it and that Ruane and Allnutt weren't even party to the decision. Not sure how true that is, but Nucifora is rated on there being four competitive Irish teams feeding into the national side and Ulster's and Connacht's struggles this season have now led to Kiss and Keane being fired.

Banm wrote: A lot of people were writing off Leo Cullen when he took over Leinster

Until he got the experienced Mr Lancaster to join him they were.............

Banm wrote: A lot of people were writing off Leo Cullen when he took over Leinster

A lot of people would have been right if they didn't get Lancaster in to hold his hand

A lot of people were writing off Leo Cullen when he took over Leinster

ConnachtCows wrote: 2. His first season in charge is quite similar to Lam's so I think it seems very reactive

KK's record is pretty much identical to Lam's final season: 12 wins and a draw from 28 games for KK as opposed to 12 games from 29. Granted we were in the Challenge Cup this year but we didn't have 2 games against a disinterested Zebre, and Toulouse last year were at the level Oyannax and Brive are this. Fewer mortifications last year but no landmark Interpro record.

We sometimes forget just how awful Lam's first season was: just 9 wins, and 5 of those against Italian teams. Heartily agree with everything else you said though.

On whether this is a good idea: If we hire another southern hemisphere coach who rolls in here a fortnight before next season kicks off, with a squad put together by someone else, then firing Keane was dumb as a bag of hammers. We'd be hamster wheeling. If we have someone to go day one of preseason, then this may yet be for the best.

On those firing KK: I think Ruane's continued employment (and possibly Allnutt's) should rest on whether he gets this next head coach signing right. He has a so-so record thus far: an impressive record in terms of retention, as against zero progress on a stadium despite a lot of waffling. Firing Keane yesterday is an admission he got his first coach hiring wrong & puts him firmly in the debit column overall. If he gets next coach hiring wrong and/or we lose players this autumn (Munster may make eyes as Dillane again, McFarland may fancy some proper forwards he previously worked with) he needs to get the push.

On the successor: Carolan & Duffy have 4 seasons out of age grade coaching between them. I think they both have potential to be head coaches with us, thought Duffy might succeed Keane (in a few years) and Carolan might follow on for him. But it's definitely too soon for either of them, I'd hate to see potential Ireland coaches/head coaches of the future wasted through premature promotion. Looking at successors, given the time of year we're probably doing to have to look at left-field punts like Davidson or Ryan.

If they take on Jackman after a season where he managed to win 2 games my head might explode. No way in hell I can see it happening. Anyway, things can surely on get better for him at Dragons with some decent signings.

If they're looking externally pickings are slim. Jim Mallinder maybe?

Next Coach? You would have to assume they have somebody in mind and we wont be starting another season without a head Coach to lead the preseason. I am going to go for Geordie Murphy. He wanted the Cardiff job and has expressed a desire to return home. I think he would fit the personality we are looking for. Simon Easterby is another possibility if he wants to return to club management. However you would think it is too close to the WC and if he was interested that he would have got the Ulster job. Please God not Jackman. After that I havent a clue, maybe Kieran Crowley.

Maybe KK leaked it

My initial thoughts from the outside, are that this is a bad idea
1. I dont think it's fair to judge a coach on 1 season, especially when he only arrived late last summer
2. His first season in charge is quite similar to Lam's so I think it seems very reactive
3. I hope the branch is not comparing Keane's personality to Lam's. No two coaches are the same
4. I hope it wasn't player power that forced Keane out
5. Unless we have a top level coach ready to come in already (or someone internal), we might as well write off next season too

On the flip side,
If Keane has lost the majority of the squad (not just some of the more vocal players)
If he has been clashing with the other coaches
Then I can see why he is been getting rid of

Finally, it has been handled atrociously. Whoever leaked it to the press should be ashamed. Let the branch and Keane conduct their business privately, and then let it be announced. Leaking the news is no good to anyone

overstrander wrote: But he doesn't live down the road from Leinster, Munster and Ulster.

I dunno. Junction 19 on the M17 is only a stones throw away, and from there, he's only down the road from the whole world.

Surprised, but having slept on it I feel it's probably a good call. We don't know what went on behind closed doors, but considering his public demeanor, it's not hard to believe he could have gotten on peoples wrong side in the club house. In the post Ospreys craggy pod, Jimmy Duffy pretty openly contradicted Keane, which set alarm bells ringing for me. It may be that he not only lost the backing of the players, but perhaps even his own coaching ticket.

Now, regarding a replacement, one of the main criteria for me would be pre-season availability. I'd personally be happy with Carolan.

Finally, I wish him all the best. It certainly seems like he may have had the rug pulled from beneath him which can't be nice, and it's definitely not common in Rugby (and hopefully it won't become so).

RoadRunnerR1 wrote:

overstrander wrote: Can't believe I'm the first to suggest it, but Eddie O'Sullivan lives just down the road.

The Words Frying Pan and Fire come straight to mind. The guys address cannot be a criteria for the job. Ask yourself why it seems clear he's never even been considered when positions became vacant at Leinster, Munster and Ulster or before the appointments of Lam and KK. We cannot afford another mistake or all the great work done under Lam's tenure will all be undone.

But he doesn't live down the road from Leinster, Munster and Ulster.

overstrander wrote: Can't believe I'm the first to suggest it, but Eddie O'Sullivan lives just down the road.

The Words Frying Pan and Fire come straight to mind. The guys address cannot be a criteria for the job. Ask yourself why it seems clear he's never even been considered when positions became vacant at Leinster, Munster and Ulster or before the appointments of Lam and KK. We cannot afford another mistake or all the great work done under Lam's tenure will all be undone.

Kieran Crowley is coming to the end of a two year contract with Benneton but has an option of extending it by another two. If he hasn't yet signed that extension he'd be a very desirable option. Robbie Deans, Rob Penney and Tony Brown (Assistant to Jamie Joseph) could probably be coaxed out of oblivion in Japan.

Can't believe I'm the first to suggest it, but Eddie O'Sullivan lives just down the road.

sligsup wrote:

ShanetTri wrote: Dare I say the replacement is already there.....Nigel Carolan??

Not for me he is as just as much to answer for as KK . He was the backs coach in a misfiring back line so no thank you

Good point that. We finished 11th overall but the attack (9th in tries/points scored) was a lot closer to matching our league position than the defence (6th or 7th best depending on whether you're looking at tries or points).