Boooooooooooo

The only good thing you can say about that game is that they didn't lose. When I first saw all the young backs named in the side I thought just maybe they would cut loose and score a bucketload of tries but that was never going to happen with them as static as they were and with all the poor passing. Some of the decision making as to when to pass or go on their own was comical. Even though they still have a chance to move on, I'm not looking forward to Saturday's game. The only hope Connacht have is if on the basis of that performance Saracens take them too lightly. Can't see that happening with a quarterfinal place on the line.

I think you're probably right and if it wasn't for two good sixes ahead of him and only one aging 8, he probably would be a 6.
I think bulk does have a big impact on how a player stays over a ball carrier on the ground and prevents the opposition rucking the ball back. Its not the be all and end all but its a factor.

Also I think someone said that McKeon was hanging out in the backs for this game? Heenan did the same in the first half of the Toulouse game at home, and JHW/Muldoon can often be found on the wing these days. Its a Lam tactic similar to Penney's imo but not been pointed out in the media at every moment like they did to Penney last year. Unfortunately as mentioned there's no one in the pack punching holes in the defensive line so it doesn't appear to be very effective.

phatguerilla wrote:

The Outlaw wrote:
Lack of capable ball carrying forwards in the back 5 of the pack is our single limiting factor in my view. Mc Keon is just too small to be an 8 at this level for me. Just over 16 stone. George North is a winger and he's bigger then that.

I agree weight is a factor but not the biggest one, Heenan is probably the lightest forward, certainly lightest backrower and still carries effectively. One issue for too long has been forwards taking the ball static/carrying from too deep. I'd like to see McKeon bulk up in the next year but that won't necessarily change how he carries by itself.

I think Mc Keon is a 6 and would make a very good one.

He's not an 8 in my opinion and its as much a power issue as weight. Bulk is not as important at 7.

We don't have a big man in the pack who is good at trucking up slow ball either. We won't always be on the front foot.

sea_point wrote:

connachtcl wrote: Can't understand this myth that George offers more better ball carrying and helps the scrum. McKeon is a much better ball carrier and controls the ball better at the base of the scrum. You only have to look at today as an example, George cost us dear in the second half, by not controlling the ball properly in the scrum. Love what he has done for Connacht but I'm afraid he's past it now and doesn't even warrant a place on the bench!

Very unhappy with today. Zebre are really awful and we didn't put the m to the sword at all. So many missed opportunities that we may end up regretting after next week. Am I right in saying that if Sarries get a losing BP tomorrow we have to beat them by more than 7 points to come second next week?

What Myth, have you ever actually played in the pack before or specifically at eight? You're measuring Georges performance on 15mins and one unstable scrum which made the channel ball rubbish for him.

He's three three inches taller and two stone heavier than McKeon, so with best will in the world (and everything else being equal) there is no way that he is worse at locking the scrum than Eoin or taking ball on and we know what he offers at lineout time.

A lot is expected of George and to in all honesty this evening he certainly was no worse than McKeown who was pretty anonymous despite us dominating much of the game possession wise...

I can have an opinion without having played in the pack. Also, I'm not judging him on one performance, I'm judging him on the whole year. He has had a problem all year controlling the ball at scrumtime. I'd agree that McKeon had a poor game, as did most of the team yesterday. However, we get noticeably worse when George comes on due to the issues and the scrum and he regularly loses yards when ball carrying.

Good to see that Toulose did us a favour today. It was a nice physical game as well so the six day turnaround for them should help us nicely! Thought they were really poor to be honest and we know they are there for the taking from the first fixture.

We are definitely missing McCarthy and the George of old as go to ball carriers. Jason carries well but tends to get isolated a lot. Hard to see where we will find the players to fix this.

Finished 21-11 to Toulouse, no LBP for Saracens so next week win or bust

The Outlaw wrote:
Lack of capable ball carrying forwards in the back 5 of the pack is our single limiting factor in my view. Mc Keon is just too small to be an 8 at this level for me. Just over 16 stone. George North is a winger and he's bigger then that.

I agree weight is a factor but not the biggest one, Heenan is probably the lightest forward, certainly lightest backrower and still carries effectively. One issue for too long has been forwards taking the ball static/carrying from too deep. I'd like to see McKeon bulk up in the next year but that won't necessarily change how he carries by itself.

12-8 to Toulouse at half time. Saracens with the only try and held off a Toulouse onslaught at one stage. We'll really have to up our game up front if we are to give ourselves a chance next week.

The next 40 mins will give us a clear idea of what we need to do but its really hard to fancy us next week.

Heard from more than one person that Pat Lam tore strips out of the lads afterwards. Good to see that he just doesn't accept the win and move on.

Good he needed to. We're trying to keep supporters if we expect to sell tickets with that type of abject rugby then we're fooling ourselves.

sea_point wrote:

theCulk wrote: We paid particular attention to Eoin at 8 today. While he made his tackles he offered nothing in attack. Too often he was hanging out in the backs, hands on hips watching the forwards. Watch Robbies try again. He could have been penalised twice at the maul, maybe the only time he was hitting maul/ruck

Most worrying thing is that of the starters Jake carried for over three times as many metres as the next best forward [White], in fact Jake carried for nearly the same as all the other starting forwards (including Swifty) which probably explains why we never created more during the game nor dominated the way most of us believe we should have...

Lack of capable ball carrying forwards in the back 5 of the pack is our single limiting factor in my view. Mc Keon is just too small to be an 8 at this level for me. Just over 16 stone. George North is a winger and he's bigger then that.

Can't. Disagree with much here to be honest. I thought Matt had a great game, he was unlucky not to get the tries, very marginal things. I think we're gonna regret not coming away with the BP.

Carty had a grand game, but his first and second kicks probably should have been called for time. Hopefully just nerves, he seemed to pick up the pace afterwards.

Heard from more than one person that Pat Lam tore strips out of the lads afterwards. Good to see that he just doesn't accept the win and move on.

Gonna have to bring a bigger game to next week otherwise it's going to be an embarrassment.

I think the coach and the players knew that we would win the game and all the talk has been about the Saracens game next week. The players seemed to be playing well within themselves which made it a very dull game and the players concentration seemed poor.

Everyone knows it's about next week and I don't think not getting the bonus point will make a difference. So in a strange way I was quite pleased with the abject performance against Zebre.

Team selection next week will be crucial, Leader looked a bit uncertain under the high ball in the 2nd half and I don't think he's offers that much more than Duffy in attack.

theCulk wrote: We paid particular attention to Eoin at 8 today. While he made his tackles he offered nothing in attack. Too often he was hanging out in the backs, hands on hips watching the forwards. Watch Robbies try again. He could have been penalised twice at the maul, maybe the only time he was hitting maul/ruck

Most worrying thing is that of the starters Jake carried for over three times as many metres as the next best forward [White], in fact Jake carried for nearly the same as all the other starting forwards (including Swifty) which probably explains why we never created more during the game nor dominated the way most of us believe we should have...

We paid particular attention to Eoin at 8 today. While he made his tackles he offered nothing in attack. Too often he was hanging out in the backs, hands on hips watching the forwards. Watch Robbies try again. He could have been penalised twice at the maul, maybe the only time he was hitting maul/ruck

Borders no.2 wrote: Just as a by the way on this. The Rotherham team that started v Cornish Pirates below contained 9 of the starting side, 3 of the replacements and 17 of the 23 who lined out against Connacht back in October in Galway so it wasn't too weakened.

Point is really that the Eagles is a scratch side especially this year even despite the extra games from the B&I, if the core of the players used were playing competitive games together week in week out like their opponents they would be much more competitive home and away. Very hard to build cohesion, understanding and consistency just on the training field.