Is it safe to assume this had David Nucifora written all over it?

Good luck to him he is a potential Irish Scrumhalf - great move for him and Ulster (and IRFU)

John Cooney to Ulster announced.

www.ulsterrugby.com/news/15647.php#.WHy6glOLQps

great Player, wish him all the best.

Independent reporting that Josh Rowland went off injured after 28 minutes in the Eagles game on Saturday...

www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/connacht-...h-hope-35369885.html

Stockdale will be a star for Ireland in a few year. Great gears and class player. They struggle to recruit players from other provinces and too many players kept like Diack who should have been moved on. When you bring in a player he needs to be shipped out if it doesnt work out

Shelflife wrote: I dunno, taking in young raw players like Dillane , Marmion and Belham and turning them into A: Pro12 and European cup standard and B : International standard players is no mean feat and imo is something that we should be very proud of.

For a province that has had up until recently a very small schools base to draw from I think we have done a remarkable job.

Creating a schools base like they have in Leinster is a huge job and will take generations to achieve, great steps have been taken over the last number of years and as a ref we are now travelling to schools that were never fielding teams before.

Considering we operate in a province where Rugby is perhaps up to this anyway the 3rd or 4th sport in schools I think we are doing a great job.

The money that the top 6 schools have in Leinster is staggering compared to those in Connacht. I'm familiar with the resources in Garbally and its on a tight budget.
The facilities, Strength and Conditioning coaches, Diet plans and exams moved to facilitate rugby.

For Connacht to have provided so many top players lately is a great achievement.

Damn! McCloskey! Knew I'd missed someone.

I'd agree they have been a mess the past few years but underage in international terms they have still being producing top young players.

Why are these guys not coming through? Obviously the team as you say is full of imports which are to some extent blocking the way but I think it has an awful lot more to do with the managerial changes up there. If you want a manager to promote youth then he has to be given a longer term to produce results. Look at Leinster under certain managers in your figures above. They have not given chances to younger players in anywhere near the numbers they are this year in a long time.

I think if Ulster get the management structure right they will be able to bring through more of those starlets like Stockdale, mcphillips, dow, to international level like their other youngsters Henderson, Gilroy, Jackson, olding, marshal mccloskey etc etc

clanman wrote: I just think taking young lads in from Munster, Australia or England is nothing to be proud of. I agree the academy system has done a great job developing these players.

having home grown underage talented lads is what we should be aiming for and our academy is far below the standards of the other provinces. lets hope gavin duffy and whoever is involved can start getting more schools and players to take rugby seriously, we've made some progress but not enough

Home Grown Only is not enough. The Academy concept is to hothouse young talented players and efficiently bring them through to professional level. To do that you need to have a critical mass of talent in order to drive the collective on. Being big fish in a small pond won't develop young players to the required standard. You need to get the best players available in Connacht and further afield and put them in the optimum setting to develop and mature into top level players. Part of that is the drive and ability of the players themselves. Running the selection along some type of sectarian lines would defeat the purpose and ultimately limit the possibilities for those in the academy.

I'd be a lot harsher on Ulster. Their academy is broken, no Irish international from it in three years and counting, squad filled with non Ulster players like O'Connor, Browne, Ross, Warwick and so on, it's not even producing provincial standard players any more. The age profile of some of their best players isn't good (e.g. Best, Trimble, Payne, Henry) so I think things will get worse for them before they get better.

salmson wrote:

clanman wrote: as far as our Academy goes I think it falls well short of the exaggerated praise it gets

Think you're being exceptionally harsh, it being the academy wasn't funded to the same extent as the other provinces (as per the senior team) until a few years ago.

The stand-out academy over the last 5 years is Leinster. The obviously underperforming one is Ulster: they have had the same number of academy graduates capped as Connacht (which is nuts considering the population and schools-game gaps), and none in the last 3 calendar years.

On a holistic front, we have the joint most new caps (tied with Leinster) in 2015 & 2016), and of the 3 ex-AIL/non-academy players capped over the last 5 years 2 were with Connacht. We've produced more new caps than Ulster in the last 5 years, which shows what am absolute heap they're in.

2016 Academy graduates:
Leinster 6 (Carbery, Leavy, Luke McGrath, Ringrose, Tracy, Van Der Flier)
Connacht 3 (Bealham, Dillane, O’Halloran)
Munster 3 (Holland, John Ryan, O’Donoghue)

2016 Non-academy:
Connacht 3 (Adeolokun, Healy, Roux)
Munster 1 (Stander)
Ulster 1 (Reidy)

2015 Academy graduates:
Leinster 1 (Furlong)

2015 Non-academy:
Connacht 1 (White)

2014 Academy graduates:
Leinster 4 (Moore, Murphy, Reid, Dominic Ryan)
Munster 2 (Cronin, Foley)
Connacht 1 (Marmion)

2014 Non-academy:
Ulster 3 (Diack, Herring Payne)
Connacht 1 (Ah You)
Munster 1 (Copeland)

2013 Academy graduates:
Leinster 5 (Downey, Hagan, Dave Kearney, Jack McGrath, Madigan)
Ulster 4 (Jackson, Luke Marshall, Paul Marshall, Olding)
Munster 3 (Archer, O’Donnell, Sherry)
Connacht 1 (Henshaw)

2012 Academy Graduates
Munster 3 (Kilcoyqne, O’Mahon, Zebo)
Ulster 2 (Gilroy, Henderson)
Connacht 1 (Loughney)

2012 Non-academy:
Leinster 2 (Bent, Strauss)

Total Academy Graduates
Leinster 16
Munster 11
Connacht 6
Ulster 6

Non-Academy Players capped:
Connacht 5 (2 ex-AIL)
Ulster 4
Munster 2 (1 ex-AIL)
Leinster 2

Note: I counted Copeland as a non-academy graduate (he quit Leinster to concentrate on college) and Downey as a Leinster academy graduate. You could just as easy switch them round but the provincial totals wouldn't change.

Excellent post salmson but playing devil's advocate, and I'll admit my post will be very subjective and open to contrasting opinion, I'd say that the quality of graduates needs to be taken into account.

Coming out of Ulster I would count 7 of the 10 as either proper international quality or will be in the future

Leinster: 11/12

Connacht: 9

Munster: 5 (at a push)

Based on this admittedly subjective analyses of the academies international output I'd say Leinster are doing about right, Ulster slightly under achieving, Connacht massively over achieving and Munster massively under achieving.

clanman wrote: I just think taking young lads in from Munster, Australia or England is nothing to be proud of. I agree the academy system has done a great job developing these players.

having home grown underage talented lads is what we should be aiming for and our academy is far below the standards of the other provinces. lets hope gavin duffy and whoever is involved can start getting more schools and players to take rugby seriously, we've made some progress but not enough

The academy isn't funded to take lads in at 8 years old and even if it were it would take circa 15 years to bring this talent through.
We are working with the smallest number of indigenous players in the country, and you have to look at where we have come from with soccer never mind rugby being banned in my national school less than 30 years ago.

All the academy can realistically do is work with players that have the raw materials to make it as a professional.

In the next 10-15 years we will reap the full dividend of what Nigel and Pat have done for connacht rugby as the support for coaching in the schools and clubs around the province is huge compared to what it was and the numbers playing the game have increased dramatically.

To knock our academy for the wonderful work they have done is just wrong (imo*)

I dunno, taking in young raw players like Dillane , Marmion and Belham and turning them into A: Pro12 and European cup standard and B : International standard players is no mean feat and imo is something that we should be very proud of.

For a province that has had up until recently a very small schools base to draw from I think we have done a remarkable job.

Creating a schools base like they have in Leinster is a huge job and will take generations to achieve, great steps have been taken over the last number of years and as a ref we are now travelling to schools that were never fielding teams before.

Considering we operate in a province where Rugby is perhaps up to this anyway the 3rd or 4th sport in schools I think we are doing a great job.

"bringing players in who have been rejected elsewhere but turn out to be just as good or better than their counterparts is just as satisfying to me. I think a lot of those players are grateful for Connacht giving them the opportunity to play a lot of rugby and have a lot of loyalty to the province because of it too"

This is hugely important to the Irish rugby system as the likes of Dillane would have been lost to rugby if it was not for our academy and there will be more with our academy now being reasonably resourced.

I just think taking young lads in from Munster, Australia or England is nothing to be proud of. I agree the academy system has done a great job developing these players.

having home grown underage talented lads is what we should be aiming for and our academy is far below the standards of the other provinces. lets hope gavin duffy and whoever is involved can start getting more schools and players to take rugby seriously, we've made some progress but not enough

Dominic Ryan graduated from the academy in 2014? He's 26 and made his Leinster debut in 2009, that can't be right can it?

Edit: never mind... I'm a dumbass, he was capped in 2014, I get you..

Good post though, I have no idea how anybody could be so critical of our academy. Apart from all the excellent points already made Connacht are at a huge disadvantage population wise so are unlikely to ever be able to produce as many home grown players, but bringing players in who have been rejected elsewhere but turn out to be just as good or better than their counterparts is just as satisfying to me. I think a lot of those players are grateful for Connacht giving them the opportunity to play professional rugby and have a lot of loyalty to the province because of it too.

clanman wrote: as far as our Academy goes I think it falls well short of the exaggerated praise it gets

Think you're being exceptionally harsh, it being the academy wasn't funded to the same extent as the other provinces (as per the senior team) until a few years ago.

The stand-out academy over the last 5 years is Leinster. The obviously underperforming one is Ulster: they have had the same number of academy graduates capped as Connacht (which is nuts considering the population and schools-game gaps), and none in the last 3 calendar years.

On a holistic front, we have the joint most new caps (tied with Leinster) in 2015 & 2016), and of the 3 ex-AIL/non-academy players capped over the last 5 years 2 were with Connacht. We've produced more new caps than Ulster in the last 5 years, which shows what am absolute heap they're in.

2016 Academy graduates:
Leinster 6 (Carbery, Leavy, Luke McGrath, Ringrose, Tracy, Van Der Flier)
Connacht 3 (Bealham, Dillane, O’Halloran)
Munster 3 (Holland, John Ryan, O’Donoghue)

2016 Non-academy:
Connacht 3 (Adeolokun, Healy, Roux)
Munster 1 (Stander)
Ulster 1 (Reidy)

2015 Academy graduates:
Leinster 1 (Furlong)

2015 Non-academy:
Connacht 1 (White)

2014 Academy graduates:
Leinster 4 (Moore, Murphy, Reid, Dominic Ryan)
Munster 2 (Cronin, Foley)
Connacht 1 (Marmion)

2014 Non-academy:
Ulster 3 (Diack, Herring Payne)
Connacht 1 (Ah You)
Munster 1 (Copeland)

2013 Academy graduates:
Leinster 5 (Downey, Hagan, Dave Kearney, Jack McGrath, Madigan)
Ulster 4 (Jackson, Luke Marshall, Paul Marshall, Olding)
Munster 3 (Archer, O’Donnell, Sherry)
Connacht 1 (Henshaw)

2012 Academy Graduates
Munster 3 (Kilcoyqne, O’Mahon, Zebo)
Ulster 2 (Gilroy, Henderson)
Connacht 1 (Loughney)

2012 Non-academy:
Leinster 2 (Bent, Strauss)

Total Academy Graduates
Leinster 16
Munster 11
Connacht 6
Ulster 6

Non-Academy Players capped:
Connacht 5 (2 ex-AIL)
Ulster 4
Munster 2 (1 ex-AIL)
Leinster 2

Note: I counted Copeland as a non-academy graduate (he quit Leinster to concentrate on college) and Downey as a Leinster academy graduate. You could just as easy switch them round but the provincial totals wouldn't change.